Not yet, that I have seen. They are rarely mentioned, from what I can make out.
Here is another article from Jamaica:
www.lifeofajamaican.wordpress.com/2015/03/18/close-your-doors-the-jehovahs-witnesses-are-coming/
defender of truth
JoinedPosts by defender of truth
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Jamaican news - ‘SHUNNING’: A Cult-Like Practice Of Jehovah’s Witnesses
by defender of truth inwww.jamaica-gleaner.com/article/news/20150913/shunning-cult-practice-jehovahs-witnesses
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defender of truth
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Lurker trying to gain clarity
by questioningmyfaith inhello all, i would like to first say that i am basically questioning my faith in god.
i am not negative towards the wt at all.
so honestly i am to concerned with more ad hominem attacks towards the wt because i still love the organization and the people in it.
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defender of truth
questioningmyfaith said:
But, if you have any answers to my questions about the world getting worse and mankind destroying it I would be happy to hear.
Really? Then why have you not responded to any of the replies you have already had to your questions?
Even a simple thanks to those who took the time to reply to you, would be polite.
Saintbertholdt 4 days ago
"If there is no god, is there hope for mankind"
Definitely. If you look at the statistics, for example: Average human life expectancy, average available calories per day per human, infectious disease statistics and even population growth you'll notice that things overall are getting better over time for the entire planet.
Regarding climate change: The fact that it has been detected and debated is a very good thing. You can't fix something if you don't know its broken.
"Why do humans seem to be so unable to rule themselves."
Slowly but surely the world is democratizing. This is a good thing as it also goes hand in hand with free markets which is also a good thing.
Human kind can still drop the ball in a big way, but I think that we're on the right track.
Believing in God and the Watchtower does seem to give one comfort in that one supposedly knows the future, but this is an illusion. The future is an unknown country which makes it scary but also exhilarating at the same time.
OneEyedJoe 4 days ago
This reminds me of the Socrates quote from over 1600 years ago:
The children now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise.
The fact is that every generation thinks the outgoing generation is old fashioned and that the next generation is doomed. You're focusing on the bad news which is often sensationalized and put forth more because it sells.
There's lots of good news out there too, though. There have been people in every generation for the last 2000 years that thought that "critical times hard to deal with will be here" was being fulfilled. Meanwhile the world has improved by just about every metric there is.
Billyblobber 4 days ago
Climate change isn't "hopeless." You're looking at this from a strictly human-centric perspective, first of all, which makes sense when you've been around a religion that makes humanity the center of the universe.
If humans are just another animal, then they don't matter to this planet any more than the dinosaurs, which were on the planet longer.
Even if they have an effect on the climate or blow themselves up in nuclear war, the earth will change as it has always been changing, and new life will appear or other life that survives will evolve and become the dominant species. So what humans do, only matters to humans themselves. And as such, we have the best chance of any species that ever existed on this planet to possibly outlive the planet itself (the planet will eventually die unless we can reignite the sun waaayyyy in the future - something that JWs assume God will do or something).
We are living in the best time in history. Life is safer, per capita, for people more than any time on this planet. Diseases are contained far better than they ever war. Wars are actually slowing down and have less of an impact on the average individual. People are living longer. People are getting closer towards cracking aging and other things.
The news, etc. is purposely centered around constantly scaring people so that they tune back in, but stats don't match that. Similarly, religions have to tell people everything is going badly to give their followers a reason to pour themselves into them. But, again, facts don't match this. Look these things up for yourself.
^^ Those were responses you received on this very thread.
Why do humans seem to be so unable to rule themselves.
My response to that specific question would be:
Why should mankind be expected to govern ourselves without 'getting it wrong', or taking actions that may later turn out to have negative consequences? (your question seems to imply that you may actually mean 'why does human government always have flaws and make mistakes?', otherwise it doesn't make much sense because humans clearly are able to govern themselves.. We have governments. )
In the absence of an Omniscient God who wants to sort all our problems out for us, which is like wishing Superman existed, human governments are the best we can do.. Unless you support total anarchy?
www.civilliberty.about.com/od/historyprofiles/f/why_government.htm
In future, when you start a topic, maybe just confine your remarks to the subject you wish to discuss? It was your OP and subsequent posts that brought up the very things you claim that you did not want to discuss..
To then just dismiss everything said in reply to YOUR comments without addressing what was said, really comes across as arrogant and rude.
I'll leave it there. I hope you find peace in your new belief system.
Once I embraced my atheism, rather than running from it.. everything became clearer. Perhaps because it was MY belief, not a set of beliefs imposed by a third party.
Good luck to you. ;)
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For me the worst thing is not having a helper anymore
by John Aquila inone of the things that gave me confidence in life was that i believed i had the almighty creator/god watching over me, directing me, guiding my every step, protecting me from harm, and answering my prayers.
i now know that is not the case anymore.
i finally stopped praying.
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defender of truth
For me, the best thing about becoming an atheist was realising I don't have a helper.. and that I never actually had one.
This means that everything I have ever achieved, every good deed I have done, every person I have helped along the way..
I did it myself.
;)
How's that for a different way of looking at things?
You clearly don't need an invisible helper...
You never had one in the first place.
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Jamaican news - ‘SHUNNING’: A Cult-Like Practice Of Jehovah’s Witnesses
by defender of truth inwww.jamaica-gleaner.com/article/news/20150913/shunning-cult-practice-jehovahs-witnesses
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defender of truth
What Are Some Of The Psychological Damage That Shunning Inflicts On A Person?
JD: As a controlling group, they instill "the us versus them" mentality.
All non-Jehovah's Witnesses are worldly people under Satan's rule. Therefore, association with worldly people should be limited to only necessary dealings, and for preaching.
This means that if a Jehovah's Witness leaves the organisation they have no outside support system. Their whole support structure doesn't exist.
They have no one and they have lost their entire family and friends. This is devastating.
www.jamaica-gleaner.com/article/news/20150913/shunning-cult-practice-jehovahs-witnesses
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Need Help with Blood Transfusion Illustration
by Dissonant15 inplease, who can provide an intelligent rebuttal to the following illustration?
i always thought it was bullet-proof:.
"if your doctor directs you to 'abstain from alcohol' would you be ok to have it injected into your veins rather than drink it?
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defender of truth
@Dissonant15, this page has plenty of well written articles on the blood issue:
"if your doctor directs you to 'abstain from alcohol' would you be ok to have it injected into your veins rather than drink it?
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Watchtower tax-exemption pressures mid-Hudson town
by defender of truth ina detailed report in the times herald-record by hema easley and james walsh, indicates a high level of frustration with the watchtowers expansion in the town of warwick and surrounding area.
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buying up property and paying very little in local taxes is making the town officials of warwick, ny, begin to look closer at watchtower operations.. .
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defender of truth
A detailed report in the Times Herald-Record by Hema Easley and James Walsh, indicates a high level of frustration with the Watchtower’s expansion in the town of Warwick and surrounding area.
Buying up property and paying very little in local taxes is making the town officials of Warwick, NY, begin to look closer at Watchtower operations.
www.jehovahswitnessreport.com/blog/watchtower-tax-exemption-pressures-mid-hudson-town
Also, you may want to take a look at:
www.canada.com/mobile/iphone/story.html?id=fb2642fd-7afb-4a99-8bac-f6e035967671
www.jehovahswitnessreport.com/blog/town-wants-taxes-from-watchtower-real-estate
www.churchandstate.org.uk/2015/09/americans-are-leaving-religion-why-are-we-still-subsidizing-it/
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How wonderful is JW.ORG
by Sabin inthere are some who still love the organization & the people in it.. who understand that every large organization has their own issues.. they believe the advice on what type of person you are supposed to be & how to treat others has made them a better person.
and they believe, quite frankly, even if the g.b are a bunch of narcissistic wannabe powerful guys, the worest thing they have done is to wake up people on saturday mornings.. i`ve been awake most of the night thinking about this, wondering if this person had a point.
then something came to my mind.
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defender of truth
(To summarise my post on page 1, as it's quite long)
The GB are responsible for countless children being cut off from their parents..
They use the JW's feelings;
their fear of God, and loyalty to their God, to indoctrinate millions of people into thinking that Disfellowshipping is a loving action.
Countless parents would otherwise have naturally found a way to ignore it, or get around it.
That first quote of my post clearly shows that even 'checking up on someone', your own family member, is a violation of the DF'ing arrangement.
When asked what moved him to return to Jehovah and His people after such a long time, he replied that the stand that his family took affected him.
“Had my family associated with me even a little, say to check up on me, that small dose of association would have satisfied me and likely not allowed my desire for association to be a motivating factor to return to God.”
The GB also teach that those who do not return to Jehovah before Armageddon are going to be..
The feasting by birds on the corpses of such enemies of Christ’s Kingdom rule likewise finds a correspondency here.
http://m.wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1200001734?q=birds+revelation&p=par
For further reading:
www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/salvation-only-for-jehovahs-witnesses.php#L1
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How wonderful is JW.ORG
by Sabin inthere are some who still love the organization & the people in it.. who understand that every large organization has their own issues.. they believe the advice on what type of person you are supposed to be & how to treat others has made them a better person.
and they believe, quite frankly, even if the g.b are a bunch of narcissistic wannabe powerful guys, the worest thing they have done is to wake up people on saturday mornings.. i`ve been awake most of the night thinking about this, wondering if this person had a point.
then something came to my mind.
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defender of truth
I should perhaps have added..
Obviously my above post applies to all family relationships, not just parent/child relationships.
The parent/child example just highlights the merciless rigidity of the shunning policy.
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Lurker trying to gain clarity
by questioningmyfaith inhello all, i would like to first say that i am basically questioning my faith in god.
i am not negative towards the wt at all.
so honestly i am to concerned with more ad hominem attacks towards the wt because i still love the organization and the people in it.
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defender of truth
Because quite frankly, even if the GB are a bunch of narcissistic wannabe powerful guys, imho, the worst thing they have done is wake up people on saturday mornings.
@questioningmyfaith
This is an interesting thought.
Please see my post on this thread, if you are interested in the views of others:
www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/470790004/how-wonderful-jw-org#/469960005
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How wonderful is JW.ORG
by Sabin inthere are some who still love the organization & the people in it.. who understand that every large organization has their own issues.. they believe the advice on what type of person you are supposed to be & how to treat others has made them a better person.
and they believe, quite frankly, even if the g.b are a bunch of narcissistic wannabe powerful guys, the worest thing they have done is to wake up people on saturday mornings.. i`ve been awake most of the night thinking about this, wondering if this person had a point.
then something came to my mind.
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defender of truth
Quite frankly, even if the G.B are a bunch of narcissistic wannabe powerful guys, the WORST thing they have done is to wake up people on Saturday mornings.
The Governing Body have instructed millions of Witnesses, in God's behalf, that anyone the elders decide is to be dispellowshipped must be cut off and not spoken to.. They have told millions that this is a matter of loyalty to God, a command from Almighty God himself.
Further they have repeatedly and relentlessly indoctrinated millions of people to see the shunning as a loving action.. Even when their own beloved children are disfellowshipped.
Robert was disfellowshipped for nearly 16 years, during which time his parents and siblings firmly and loyally applied the direction in God’s Word to quit mixing in company with wrongdoers, not even greeting such ones. Robert has been reinstated for some years now and is progressing well spiritually.
When asked what moved him to return to Jehovah and His people after such a long time, he replied that the stand that his family took affected him.
“Had my family associated with me even a little, say to check up on me, that small dose of association would have satisfied me and likely not allowed my desire for association to be a motivating factor to return to God.”
http://m.wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2013446#h=27:181-27:850
14 God’s Word commands that unrepentant sinners be removed from the congregation. (Read 1 Corinthians 5:9-13.)
This is necessary for at least three reasons: (1) to keep Jehovah’s name free from reproach, (2) to protect the congregation from contamination, and (3) to help the sinner come to repentance if possible.
15. Loyalty to Jehovah calls for an answer to what searching questions?
15 Do we share Jesus’ view of those who have become set in their lawless course?
We need to give thought to these questions: ‘Would I choose to associate regularly with someone who has been disfellowshipped or who has disassociated himself from the Christian congregation? What if that one is a close relative who no longer lives at home?’ Such a situation can be a real test of our love of righteousness and of our loyalty to God.*
16, 17. What difficulty did a Christian mother face, and what helped her to uphold the arrangement for disfellowshipping unrepentant wrongdoers?
16 Consider the experience of a sister whose adult son at one time had love for Jehovah. Later in life, however, he unrepentantly chose to practice lawlessness. Hence, he was disfellowshipped from the congregation.
Our sister loved Jehovah, but she also loved her son and found it extremely difficult to apply the Scriptural command to avoid associating with him.
17 What advice would you have given this sister? An elder helped her to realize that Jehovah understood the pain she felt. The brother invited her to think about the pain Jehovah must have experienced when some of his angelic sons rebelled.
The elder reasoned with her that even though Jehovah knows how painful such a circumstance can be, he requires that unrepentant sinners be disfellowshipped.
She took the reminders to heart and loyally upheld the disfellowshipping arrangement.* Such loyalty makes Jehovah’s heart glad.—Prov. 27:11.
18, 19. (a) Cutting off contact with a practicer of lawlessness gives evidence of our hatred for what? (b) What may result when we are loyal to God and his arrangement?
18 If you face a similar situation, please remember that Jehovah sympathizes with you.
By cutting off contact with the disfellowshipped or disassociated one, you are showing that you hate the attitudes and actions that led to that outcome.
However, you are also showing that you love the wrongdoer enough to do what is best for him or her. Your loyalty to Jehovah may increase the likelihood that the disciplined one will repent and return to Jehovah.
19 One individual who was disfellowshipped and was later reinstated wrote: “I am happy that Jehovah loves his people enough to see that his organization is kept clean.
What may seem harsh to outsiders is both necessary and really a loving thing to do.”
Do you think that this person would have been helped to come to such a conclusion had members of the congregation, including her family, maintained regular contact with her while she was disfellowshipped?
Our supporting the Scriptural arrangement of disfellowshipping gives evidence that we love righteousness and recognize Jehovah’s right to set standards of conduct.
19, 20. (a) How has Christ gradually helped his followers to refine the way serious wrongdoing is handled? (b) What are three reasons for disfellowshipping unrepentant wrongdoers?
19 Back in 1892, the Watch Tower commented that it is “our duty to disfellowship (as Christians) those who, either directly or indirectly, deny that Christ gave himself a ransom [a corresponding price] for all.” (Read 2 John 10.) In 1904, the book The New Creation acknowledged that those who persist in wrong conduct pose a real danger of demoralizing the congregation.
Back then, the entire congregation would participate in “church trials” to examine cases of serious wrongdoing. However, such occasions were rare.
In 1944, The Watchtower showed that only responsible brothers should handle such matters.
In 1952 a Bible-based procedure for handling judicial matters was published in The Watchtower, highlighting a key reason for disfellowshipping unrepentant ones—to keep the congregation clean.
20 In the decades since then, Christ has helped his followers to clarify and refine the handling of serious cases of wrongdoing. Christian elders are carefully trained to care for judicial matters in Jehovah’s way...
http://m.wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102014250#h=25:608-25:799
The Governing Body decide the judicial procedures.. as well as all the instructions in the Watchtower publications, and when the publications are to be studied.
The responsibility of the Governing Body is clear;
for indoctrinating well-meaning parents to believe that DFing is a direct command from God, and necessary to save their childs life (what parent would not do absolutely anything to save their children??).
The only people who cannot see the effect of the undue influence the GB and their teachings have exerted.. are people who do not understand the effect of undue influence, or they are still under it's influence themselves.
Steven Alan Hassan’s BITE Model to Mind Control & Undue Influence
It is important to understand that destructive mind control can be determined when the overall effect of these four components promotes dependency and obedience to some leader or cause.
It is not necessary for every single item on the list to be present...
www.truthrundown.net/think-about-it/cult-expert-steven-hassan/
